Influencer marketing software is a hell of a lot of confusing. There are platforms that do everything … help you find, prioritize, analyze, select, book, contract, collaborate, review, measure and even pay creators. Then there are softwares that do just one of those things. And some that do 2-3 of those tasks.

Then there are managed services that will do all or part of the full process for you.

But then there are derivations of all that that only do one platform, like TikTok or Instagram, but nothing else. Then some that do millions of influencers. Others that have a database of just hand-picked creators. Others that are only micro-influencers.

Then those can be broken down by network or feature.

It’s maddening.  

One such derivative of influence marketing software that I’ve never really been a fan of is marketplaces. This is where a brand can go post their influence or creative need like they would on Craig’s List. Wanted: Online content creators with X numbers of followers to post about this brand for Y dollars. Creators plugged into that marketplace can apply. You don’t normally get big audience, or even highly relevant creators, but you can go grab a bunch of willing participants if you like.

Tinashe Chopanda runs a marketplace, of sorts, but certainly knows the influencer space well. He is a former creator and influencer in his own right. He built a nice YouTube following with Okay Tinashe … which was a reaction channel to K-Pop videos and such. Funny, engaging stuff. You can go look that up if you like.

But he got into optimizing videos and digital ad campaigns. He started pitching brands to be on  his channel as sponsors. Then he realized being behind the camera and development of brand deals and partnerships was where his passion really laid. 

Today, he’s the man behind Sosani, and influence marketing agency that connects content creators with brands to tell stories and create great content. Part of Sosani is a bit of an influencer marketplace so I pushed on him a bit to convince me marketplaces are worth my time. We talked about his process and thoughts around building better influence campaigns and content. And I asked him if he had to do it all over again with Okay Tinashe, what would he do differently.

Good stuff from a former big shot YouTuber turned influence marketing strategist and agency owner Tinashe Chopanda, on today’s episode of Winfluence.

This episode of Winfluence is presented by Tagger, a complete influence marketing software solution. Check them out for a demo today at

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Tinashe Chaponda on Winfluence Transcript

[00:00:00] Jason: On this episode of Winfluence.

[00:00:02] Tinashe: On the content series, it really does give you more room to be agile. It allowed us week by week to tweak in terms of what was working to pivot, some of the ideas were also very just in the moment. And, really the key difference has to come down to, it gives brands the ability to have your on the goal content team, in a way.

[00:00:22] Jason: There’s a difference between being an influencer and actually influencing. I’m Jason Falls, and in this podcast we explore the people, companies, campaigns and stories that illustrate that difference. Welcome to Winfluence, the Influence Marketing Podcast.

Hello again friends, thanks for listening to Winfluence the Influencer Marketing podcast. Influencer marketing software is a hell of a lot of confusing. There are platforms that do everything, help you find, prioritize, analyze, select ,book, contract, collaborate, review, measure, and even pay creators. Then there are softwares that do just one of those things and some that do two, three, or four of those tasks, but not the others.

Then there are managed services that will do all or part of the full process for you, but then there are derivations of all that, that only do one platform like TikTok or Instagram, but nothing else. Then some that do millions of influencers, others that have a database of just handpicked creators, others that are only micro influencer focused, and then those can be broken down by network or feature.

It’s maddening. One such derivative of influence marketing software that I’ve never really been a fan of is marketplaces. This is where a brand can go post their influence or creative need like they would on Craigslist: “Wanted Online Content Creators With X Number of followers To Post About this Brand For Y Dollars”.

Creators plugged into that marketplace can apply, you don’t normally get big audiences or even highly relevant creators, but you can go grab a bunch of willing participants if you like. Tinashe Chaponda runs a marketplace of sorts, but certainly knows the influencer space well. He’s a former creator and influencer in his own right.

He built a nice YouTube following with, OKAY tinashe, which was a reaction channel to K-pop videos and such funny, engaging stuff. You can go look that up if you like. But he got into optimizing videos and digital ad campaigns. He started pitching brands to be on his channel as sponsors, and that’s where he realized being behind the camera and the development of a brand deal and partnership was where his passion really laid.

Today, he’s the man behind Sosani an influence marketing agency that connects content creators with brands to tell stories and create great content. Part of Sosani is a bit of an influencer marketplace, so I pushed on him a bit to convince me marketplaces are worth my time. We talked about his process and thoughts around building better influence campaigns and content, and I asked him if he had it all to do over again with OKAY tinashe. What would he do differently?

Good stuff from a former big shot YouTuber turned influence marketing strategist and agency owner Tinashe Chaponda coming up on Winfluence. Now, as you probably know by now, the Influence marketing software I do endorse and use every day is Tager it is the presenting sponsor of this show.

I use Tager to find, engage, hire, collaborate, review, and measure all my Influence marketing efforts, it’s a soup to nuts platform. I actually sat down with a couple content creators recently and showed them all the data I have about them thanks to Tager, they were really fascinated. I showed them how Tager lets me find not just their engagement rate in followers, but how many actual people are engaged with their average content, how they compare to others that might be competing for the same brand dollars and more.

They quickly understood how I can narrow down the more right influencers from my clients. Now I could go on, but you know I use Tager every day. You should check it out too. It might be right for your brand or agency. Just go to to get a free demo and see if Tager is right for you. Just a free demo, that’s all I ask. I mean, worst case scenario, you get to see cool software for a few minutes. Go check it out.

Let’s make more sense of all this influencer marketing software and marketplaces, and build smarter strategies Tinashe Chaponda from Sosani is next, on Winfluence..

Tinashe I want to, uh, dig into what you’re doing now, but I think what you did to get here is great context for that. You carved out a nice niche for yourself on YouTube once upon a time, if memory serves, right? Tell me about OKAY tinashe.

[00:04:59] Tinashe: Oh, OKAY tinashe. Yeah, so essentially, um, I got into the Instagram and YouTube space, I believe back in 2016. It was after I had an internship at Goldman Sachs. I got a return offer and instead of going there for the next year. I essentially dropped out of business school and said I want to do this Influencer social media thing. So I essentially started making comedy videos in 2016 and 17, and then a friend approached me and essentially was like” Hey, I know we’ve been doing Instagram, we haven’t made any money”.

“I heard of this YouTube thing and reaction videos, it’s called K-pop and BTS” .I was like,” K-pop, what is that?” He’s like, “I don’t know what it is, but I’ve made $200 in the last two months”. So I essentially put all my focus into, uh, creating a, uh, OKAY tinashe YouTube channel and essentially would have different, uh, people book from campus come and react to K-pop videos.

So that was really my first experience into the Influencer space was through reacting to BTS, Black Pink and me seeing this obsession that these fans had around these group of people and essentially from there, a friend of mine, uh, his name is Caleb, did paid ads. Essentially he said” Hey, do you wanna come create content for me”,” it’s this thing I do called Facebook ads”. And I had no idea what that was. So he showed me the back end one day of a Facebook, you know, business and I’m seeing 50,000, 100,000 dollars in all this video, and that’s when essentially I made that shift over to, uh, the digital aspect end but ,really through the YouTube channel that allowed me to really understand, you know, cultivating an audience, so what it meant, you know, to understand of reading the comments and knowing what audience want.

It really got me into SEO and optimizing videos and how, how can I get this video to a 100,000, you know, 300,000 views. But that was really my first really understanding digital marketing and building a brand.

Then, really the influencer side was I was able to pitch some, uh, brands myself to, uh, get on my channel. Then I got Plato’s Closet to allow me to create two videos and then took me to the store, let me use their employees to create this content. And that was really when I realized what my passion was, and it really wasn’t being the one in front of the camera, but the one behind understanding the development.

So that’s essentially when I got lucky and got into working on the agency side of things. And now where I’m at with, uh, Sosani our agency, our Influencer agency. A lot of it has came from that history of that channel.

[00:07:23] Jason: Well, I know you said your friend kind of told you about it. But I, I wanna dive in a little bit more to the whole idea to center your content around reacting to other people’s content. It’s so simple, but I think there’s really an art form to doing it in a way that makes people wanna watch, right?

[00:07:40] Tinashe: Yeah. So the thing that I’ve noticed that seems to be the most hardest for creating, but it’s actually the easiest, is allowing the audience to tell you what they want. That was the first thing is because of reaction videos, there was constantly new videos, new trends, new songs.

So it really allowed me, and forced me to be in my comments because if I wasn’t, people were saying, well, you gotta do this or, or maybe I’ll talk about a certain person and they said, that’s not really who they are, this is what they’re about. So even the community started teaching me, but when it came to reacting and being able to sit down, you know, and watch hours of content and keep a certain energy, I started to really understand and learn about content and how to react and when to react.

And that was when I started realizing like, Oh, this is what goes into a content that makes people feel this certain way or react a certain way. Because the only way people loved really watching our content was because of the, not only just the reaction, but how deep we got. Especially in that K-pop niche, they are very obsessive of a niche, but very loyal.

You know, like that’s one of those, I would say, niches that if anyone wants to, you know, start a business in or figure out how to get into, if you can get a K-pop lover behind you, they really move. So it was really my experience of adapting to what the community wanted.

[00:08:54] Jason: Well, I don’t know a whole lot about K-Pop, but I, the one thing I do know is, you’re right man, the fans of K-Pop are obsessive fans and just incredibly intense, and that intensity is also something that came across in your videos.

I think the reason for me, that, that content, although I didn’t see it when it first came out, I kind of went back and watched it just to prepare to talk to you. But when I saw that, the first thing that jumped off the screen at me was, this guy’s got personality to spare. Like he’s just over the top, energetic, and for a certain audience, especially a younger audience on YouTube. That’s kind of a prerequisite man. If you’re not high energy right out of the gate, they’re gonna flip onto the next video. So you did a great job of kind of building your personality into that and I think that’s why the content was so, uh, successful.

Now that channel’s kind of retired, right? That’s kind of old stuff, you don’t do that anymore, is that right?

[00:09:48] Tinashe: Yeah, yeah. Yes it is retired.

[00:09:50] Jason: Okay, well I’m just saying you got something there, if you wanna go back to it, you gotta fall back cuz the personality’s very, very good. I really wonder, if you were to do it all over again today, build a YouTube channel or more broadly, an influencer presence, knowing what you know now, what would you do differently?

[00:10:07] Tinashe: I would definitely say, building a process of content creation. I think a lot of the burnout came because I would, you know, have people come over for three, four hours. Then I would edit for another three, four hours, then be on my YouTube comments another couple hours.

So it was very strenuous. So I think the first thing is really building a process that’s able to be efficient once the content is made, but also fluid enough to have that inspiration. That would be the first thing I would say is, you know, being able to figure out, okay, how can I outsource that right editor and not try to keep everything so in-house, but really focus on the bigger picture.

Second, I would say which was part of me, you know, leaving reaction videos was original content. So during that time when I was doing the K-pop. Massive K-pop channels were getting banned because a lot of the music labels and you other countries were banning them left and right. So there’s constant like worry of I could wake up one day and my account could be banned, so it would also be like having more ownership of the content.

Which led to number three was at the pinnacle when I decided to leave was two fans actually drove six hours in a snowstorm to come to my house to react for six hours about BTS. So imagine sitting there, I’m thinking, oh yeah, they’re OKAY tinashe fan, but reality, no, I just created a channel to allow people to have discussion about another creator. So the how important it is to really work on original content and over quality, over quantity. Brought fans that are willing to, you know, drive this far to sit down with someone else for six hours and that was during the time of my turning point of I’m doing this, not necessarily the right way, and I then pivoted a couple weeks later to creating original comedy sketches.

So now I was in like different wigs and different characters. I would have different stuff and it started gaining a lot of traction and I was having some, uh, Instagram channels in, uh, UK repost me. But what I learned from that, Was that was really, I think at the pinnacle, if I would’ve continued, there was actually something there.

But to kind of wrap up, I would definitely say those are the key things is creating that process of creativity to really coming down to creating original content, to be able to actually have a true fan-base and not to feel rushed to create a lot of content, but focus on creating quality content, especially in the short form video form. It gets kind of rushed and then people get burnt out. But what I’m even noticing in the, in our agency with the influencers we sign, we do see a difference, noticing that most great creators go through seasons.

So I didn’t realize that, I just kept posting, posting, posting every day. I think I did three, four months, almost straight every day, something, you know. But then when you look at some of the Jake Paul try to do that, and you realize that’s not the way to go, but it’s actually creating really quality content and listening to your audience.

[00:12:55] Jason: Well, I can tell you, I give you a lot of credit, cuz if two fans or people claiming to be fans of mine showed up at my house, I’m not sure that there wouldn’t be a restraining order in the works there. I, I don’t know if I’d like that or not, that’s a little odd. But…

[00:13:08] Tinashe: it was planned that, you know, uh, Twitter.

[00:13:09] Jason: Yeah, yeah. I get that. I’ve, I’ve met people in person before at like conferences and stuff that i’ve met online first, but I don’t know that I would invite anybody to my house. I don’t know, that’s a little strange, but, all right. So you went from YouTuber then, and now you’re running an influencer marketing agency. Give us the elevator pitch. What does Sosani do?

[00:13:30] Tinashe: Yeah, so the easiest way we say is we help amplify brands voices, through content marketing with influencers. So a big thing about that is, a lot of times sometimes people think we are a talent management company because obviously we work with a lot of talent and some more intimately.

But at the core of what we do, it’s about creating and storytelling through content. It just happens to be through influencers and we’ll expand from there.

[00:13:56] Jason: Okay, so I’m on your site and I’m looking, and I see there’s a place for influencers or creators to go and kind of sign up to be on your roster of creators.

Here’s my kinda rub with influencer marketplaces, and I don’t know if that’s exactly what you have, but with agencies that have that sort of place to sign up and say, raise your hand if you’re a creator and you wanna work with us or influencer marketplaces. I need you to talk me off the ledge here because if I come to Sosani and let’s say I wanna find, you know, 10 or 20 people to do reels or videos about my e-commerce business. I always feel like with marketplaces like that or rosters like that I’m limited to this small group of creators that know about you and have bothered to register with you as an interested creator.

I know, however, that there are exponentially more creators that have it. And I know that most of the bigger ones don’t go sign up for marketplaces and sites like that. So I’m worried as a brand that I’m not getting a useful list of options to choose from in comparison. So tell me I’m wrong, or tell me I’m right and why I should or shouldn’t be concerned?

[00:15:00] Tinashe: Yeah. So I’m actually with you on that one, Jason. So with us specifically, our main thing is, like we say, it’s the brand that’s our number one focus and it happens to be influencers that is the vehicle we’re using. Originally we started, we were fully, uh, Gen Z with the brands we worked with, but if you are a brand, like for example, we had one come and they needed, moms, millennials, yoga teachers, and as well as teachers.

So that one we, our main thing is sourcing outside, so we’re always constantly looking for top talent. Especially when we look at TikTok. What TikTok has done such a great job of is to continuously bringing up new content creators. And because of this big push of UGC and everyone, you know, wanting to be able to create their own career and while being creative, we’ve put more focus in constantly sourcing micro influencers. So and also for nicheing, this is really what we love to do is really figure out what are new communities that we can tap to that not every other brand is doing, right? So if you are, for example, let’s say, uh, Mod Pizza, one of our clients. Pizza, most people are right, are gonna go to your typical, you know, foodies, you might go to some travel bloggers, right? So these kind of niche areas.

Our whole thing is like what are other different verticals that we can tap into? And we really focus on data, right? So we look at, okay, we’re noticing for example, random trend, let’s say from your past campaigns. We’ve noticing that there’s a lot of people that are interested in nature and really love antiques, let’s say. We would say, okay, how do we then maybe look at repositioning here and sourcing for influencing these new niches? So that’s our main focus.

[00:16:37] Jason: All right, so explain the mechanism to me. When I come to you, I sign up and say, here’s what I’m trying to do. Here’s the type of creator I want, what’s next? Take me through your process.

[00:16:47] Tinashe: Yeah, of course. So you sign up and once you give us that brief and like what you’re looking for, and once we really understand your key objectives and because I think a big thing we’ve noticed is people believe influencers and one video is the one answer to the entire funnel. So we really try to understand what part of the funnel do you need the most support and figure out what type of content makes the most sense.

So the next step from there would be really the strategy development, before even getting to the influencer. So understanding, oh, you’ve tapped into these communities, maybe let’s try to tap into these new communities. And on top of that, we wanna also make sure that we’re identifying the key influencers. So on top of bringing in strategy, then we would then source influencers that match those different types.

But not only just, oh, this is good content, but we are also noticing some creators are really good at tough funnel, where some really know how to do a damn good job, that bottle funnel of conversion once someone’s in trust. So it’s really that process of creating that strategy, then building the list, then from them, seeing which influencers fit in what part of the funnel, and then launching, and then after we launch is actual reporting as well too.

[00:17:56] Jason: Sure. We’re talking to Tinashe Chaponda from sosani we’ve heard about sosani the company. After the break, I’m gonna ask Tinashe to help walk us through the various strategies you can use to get better return from your influence efforts. Don’t go away.

Welcome back to Winfluence chatting today with Tinashe Chaponda from sosani. Tinashe, by the way, is originally born in Zimbabwe, which is how you remember to say his name, right? I learned that before we started talking .Tinashe one of the things I’ve heard you talk about that you are championing at sosani is branded content series. Now, I think I know what that is, or at least I have an idea of how I define that. But just to clarify, tell everybody what you mean by branded content series.

[00:18:44] Tinashe: Yes, of course. So the thing we’ve noticed is, especially with the rapid growth of influencer marketing, is the audiences and fans are getting burned out of those one off collaborations with brands.

So with the brand and content series, it really allows for a brand to integrate with the influencer on a longer term activation and partnership, actually helping building that trust within the fan-base. So for example, one of our clients was Cash App, our talent was name was Justin Smith. He wanted to do a tour and essentially drive around, and he’s known for creating high impact content.

Uh, either that’s blessing people or creating different projects. So creators are really good at having these, you know, ideas and using their social media platforms to accomplish it, but on the other hand, they sometimes need that support. So we felt like this was a really good opportunity to find a brand that loves to integrate with creators who have big project ideas and also love to give back to the communities and fans.

So with this, we came up with the concept of essentially packaging it up and chatted with different brands in terms of, hey, we’re looking for a brand to be part of this specific tour. Now, with us, it’s always about how do they intergrate in a seamless way. So depending on the brand and the vertical, we had different concepts.

So the brand we felt who was a bad fit was Cash App. So the campaign we created was called Cash App America, and essentially Justin drove around, uh, 48 states and gave away $54,000 throughout that entire experience. So from street performers to homeless people and being able to take him out and buy him groceries, clothes, and also putting him in a hotel.

All the way while he was in Texas, he did an activation and he gave away $5,000 to a 80 person dodge ball game 40 verse 40. Throughout that drive, it was about a six week campaign. Then we also did a surprise on Twitter, was called uh, Cash App America, where we actually ended up going trending number one on Twitter and getting fans engaged with Cash App America and this concept where at the moment we’re over 30 million views on that.

Just from one creator and it was essentially a 10 content P series. And the key thing is it was content that made sense to Justin going around interacting a big project idea. Cash App is always looking for fun ways to really target that Gen Z audience and B, subtle and within branding.

So it made sense for that partnership because Cash App loves being able to support Justin, but also giving the creator really the opportunity to come up with ways of being strategic. So branded content series is really for brands that are looking to, I would say, more top funnel and engagement for these type of specific campaigns I would say, and it’s not as much as on the conversion, especially for brands that are, hey, how do we stay relevant?

Maybe as we have a new project launch coming in three, six months, how do we just stay relevant in the moment. So it’s gonna be more definitely top funnel and engagement and growth and the socials. But then also looking at, okay, how do we create content that’s evergreen? So a lot of the content that was created, created so much different inspiration to the point where fans are engaging to the point where other people are blessing themselves.

So you have situations where, uh, one of the people he blessed is commenting in one of the videos on Facebook and you’re seeing a, hey Justin, I’m gonna end up blessing someone else. So as a brand, why you would do this is you’re really looking at hitting certain audiences, new audiences.

Two, it could be just being a refresher, for example why is it that you feel so comfortable going and buying Nike without even thinking about? It’s because they do a good job of staying relevant. So that’s really, I would say, when it comes to branded content series for the type of brands.

[00:22:23] Jason: Nice. It’s, it’s not far at all from what I would’ve said it was, when I think of the term branded content series. When I’ve pitched that label of content to people, it’s basically a web version of a TV show. It might be one person interviewing other people. It might be one influencer or creator doing a series of explainer videos tied under a theme. Or like with Justin traveling around America.

And then obviously in doing so he has to pay for things. And the thought of giving away money ties the brand in there. That’s really nice. So what you’re suggesting is, I think you know that content living on the creator’s channels, but it could also live on the brand channels too? Correct?

[00:23:03] Tinashe: Yes. Yes, exactly. And that’s the key thing. Brands are really the next media companies that really are going to have that audience reach. And that’s the great part about it is this one was absolutely specifically more on Justin’s, but this allows brands to have continual content on their platform. So we’ve had multiple campaigns where, we’ve noticing a lot of requests of just, hey, let’s do white listing.

Can we get your video? We’re gonna post it on our content. It gives brands also that IP as well too. It also gives you more content, not just for your social team to use, but now think about all the different department out there. So it helps you really also cut costs, and also it can be multi-divisional as well too.

[00:23:44] Jason: Very nice. I, I wonder what it is about this high level creative concept, which is what I would call that that works better than say, I wanna do three or four sponsored posts with one creator. Is it the long form storytelling? Is it that the audience gets emotionally invested in the topic and they wanna follow with along? I wonder, I wonder what it is that’s the difference between a three or four posts sponsorship and, hey, let’s do a content series that lasts a lot longer and is a lot deeper.

[00:24:10] Tinashe: Yeah, so the thing about the content series is you have more opportunities to be agile and learn more and adapt and shift. So with this being a 10 content series, it allowed us to gain so much data about the audience, about Cash App is what makes people excited and within those contents.

So I would say on the content series, it really does give you more room to be agile. So what I mean is it allowed us week by week to tweak in terms of what was working to pivot, some of the ideas were also very, just in the moment, like the gas video when he, he ended up paying for people with gas and it getting around town.

All very, being spontaneous and really the key difference has to come down to, it gives brands the ability to have your on the go content team in a way, right? So when you have it for these extended periods, you know, okay, this product is focused right now, but we know in a couple months have a new line.

Okay, we have this series happening, let’s just plug it in right there and keep it going. A way of thinking if it is like beats, right? Beats is such a great job of integrating into all of the artists, you know, content, you know, when they’re all underneath the same record label is really, that concept is really extending yourself and your reach and having more flexibility and control and starting to build your own assets.

While on the one off campaigns, one to two influencers, maybe you’re doing one off is those aren’t as effective when you’re really looking at gaining a lot of testing and data. I would definitely say the 1, 2, 3 influencers do work well when it’s a more targeted promotion for a targeted amount of time.

And when you’re looking at one to three, we usually recommend that you do a minimum of six pieces of content when you’re testing. And as exciting as it is when you look at these massive influencers and they have, you know, 10 million follow, let’s go after them. Where we’re putting on focus in is more on the micro and nanos. You get more bang of your buck and you’re also able to really gain more data and insights from that. So I’d definitely say that’s more on the promotional side for one promotion.

[00:26:10] Jason: Amen for that. There’s a lot of value in reach, which is the kind of the one off thing, but there’s a lot more value I think in frequency. Which is the longer term, let’s get in front of this audience a lot of times, not just a handful. So, good thinking there. So I wanna ask, cuz I think at some point there’s going to become a marriage of brands, you know, sort of coming to creators with concepts versus creators coming to brands with concept. And when we get to that point, and I think we probably have with some out there, cuz some agencies and what not are starting to think a little bit bigger in terms of influencer content and branded content series and things like that.

But I’m curious how we’re going to navigate that or how creators are gonna navigate that, because I would imagine, you know, with the program that you just described. I would imagine that all of the production and what-not was handled by the creator. You know, Justin was the creative director and the director and the producer and holding the phone or the camera and what-not, and kind of overseeing all that.

I would imagine that we’re going to reach instances where, you know, a brand comes and says, hey, we wanna engage either this creator, maybe it’s Justin, maybe it’s somebody else, or we wanna engage several creator. But we are providing the production. We’re gonna have the creative director, we’re gonna have the person there that’s actually creating the content and we want them to do their thing, but do it, you know, through our lens. Are we gonna have a hard time navigating that because of this sort of approach that has been laid out in influencer marketing where you’ve gotta let go and let the creator control everything or, or is there room for integration there?

[00:27:44] Tinashe: Yeah, I would say it has to really come down to, is it content that’s being posted on just mainly the brands platform or the influencer. That would be the first thing I would say. Um, is cuz typically what it’s more of the influencer, there is more of that, I guess, push and need for having more creative control. However, for example, it’s funny you bring that up. One of our talents is actually being flow to Tampa for a beauty shoot, which they’re doing a launch of their, uh, makeup.

But that’s only specifically for the brands account. But when you rethink about the creator, majority of them get into it because they wanna get into right one day acting. They wanna be, you know, singer, they want to be this. So I think, when it comes down to that integration, it really comes down to am I a brand that’s already built my social platforms where it’s more like I’m casting you into this? Or is it I’m, I’m a brand that’s going to need not only your likability, but your platforms in order to accomplish this? So it really comes down to who’s the one that’s providing the audience. Then in a way, I’ll definitely see there being the one with more of the negotiation power.

[00:28:47] Jason: Yeah, that makes sense.

So, you know, one thing that I encounter with some clients and people who are, you know, kind of coming to the table and saying, hey, I wanna, I’ve been thinking about using influencers, I’ve never done it before. And you know, they start to hear, okay, we’re talking about video and we’re talking about TikTok and we’re talking about Instagram and it’s gotta be video, video, video, video.

Well, when a business who hasn’t used creators before thinks influencers, and then they also think about video. Then they are going to infer that this is gonna be a significant cost compared to, you know, hey, let’s sponsor somebody’s Instagram posts for a couple weeks and see what that does. So walk us through the cost expectation.

I want to do a branded video series, or I want to do, I want to engage two or three creators to create two or three videos each for me. What do you say to a small business or any business that says, how much money am I gonna have to budget for something like this?

[00:29:36] Tinashe: Yeah, definitely. So it really comes down to a couple things, right?

One is, are you gonna do it in-house versus agency? I think that’s really where it comes down to. But on the small business side, you can typically be able to have a budget of around, I say, 5 to 10,000 per month to be able to have consistent content that is on your platform. And depending on the budget range, potentially some on some micro influencers.

And that’s essentially more focused on how do you find a micro influencer, either locally or virtually depending and because of this burst of creators, there’s so many people to pick from. And the competition is up to the influencer and experience. The second way is if you’re looking more for the Cash App America tours of the world and those type of, you know, activations typically for things like that, obviously not, not every time you’re going to need to drive around. You know, so I’d say something, even on a smaller scale, but really big content idea, you could typically start those type of ranges anywhere from 75,000 to 200,000, just depending on the type of creator that you’re going for.

Also, you gotta consider the fact that, we’re not a talent management agency, we are advertising. So part of our budgeting is also being put into paid media for white listing, right?

[00:30:46] Jason: Right.

[00:30:46] Tinashe: So we’re making, ensuring that you’re going to get a certain amount of reach, you’re gonna get a certain amount of data to actually work for and be able to use. So that would be more of that type of range.

[00:30:55] Jason: Yeah. Well, and I also, you know, wanna remind people out there who might be listening, who are relatively new to this and are trying to understand the cost parameters and the budgeting here. Remember too, that a lot of what you pay for with influencer marketing is the management of the program.

[00:31:10] Tinashe: Mm-hmm.

[00:31:11] Jason: So not all 75 or a hundred thousand dollars is going to the creator’s pocket. It’s, you know, some of it’s going to sosani to help manage everything, there’s lots of people involved in pulling this off. It’s no different than hiring a, you know, a video production house and some actors and directors and what-not to create video content for you.

It’s just kind of executes itself in a different way. The the biggest problem that I’m running into with people who come to me who are new to this and haven’t done it yet as a business, is they say, well, I’ve got a $5,000 budget. And I’ll say, well, we’re definitely gonna have to use nano influencers because most of that’s gonna be taken up with just managing what you’re doing.

[00:31:47] Tinashe: Yeah.

[00:31:47] Jason: Because there’s a lot of time that goes into, let’s do a contract and let’s get an agreement and let’s write a creative brief and let’s communicate with them. So, understand that the fee that goes to the influencer is one part of your budget. Another part is the management. And then as you just said, there’s a third part of, are you gonna put paid media spend behind it to amplify it to make sure that it really resonates and works?

So you gotta think about it more broadly than just, how much do I have to pay the influencer that’s gonna be, probably less than the third of your cost if you’re using all three of those.

[00:32:19] Tinashe: Exactly. In our demi centre local level. Um, there’s so much opportunity, especially with, TikTok now being such a search engine is, you know, it was interesting cuz uh, a couple weeks ago I was in Chicago, you know, for a date, you know, and everything.

And we were like, what are we gonna do? Oh, let’s look up, you know, things to do in Chicago, and it’s just, oh, there we go. We, we, these came up, you know, we would get to visually see us. So on a local level, you know, there’s a lot of opportunity for, uh, businesses that might be like, okay, we’re not actually ready to hire an agency. But when it’s in house, if you look up your city name and you know, and see what type of content you can find, probably someone who’s a freshman in college who’s really, really good at creating that content to hire.

And you can, you know, at least on the video cost side, be able to kind of figure out to keep that below, I’d say 1500 or 2000 a month, and especially for like a college student during that. And then looking at that other aspect of really putting that towards paid amplification.

[00:33:13] Jason: Yeah, the uh, TikTok and Instagram platforms becoming primary places for search is destroying the confidence and egos and businesses of all these SEO people that have been investing so much time and energy and YouTube and blogs and things like thats, alot years.

And it’s scaring the hell out of them cuz like, wait a minute, in order to be successful now I gotta create social content. Oh, crap, you know? So it’s fun to listen to people talk about that.

[00:33:37] Tinashe: I was gonna say, Jason, it’s, it’s a great thing in movement, right? Because, you know, you probably have witnessed where so much people just create SEO blogs. It’s clearly just to be used to get you on the site. Where now with video content, you’re, you can’t just cookie cut video and actually be found. You have to be creative, in a way.

[00:33:54] Jason: Yeah, it definitely makes the content more enriched, which for those of you who follow me on social networks, that’s exactly why I’m doing YouTube shorts, exactly why I’m doing reels, exactly why I’m doing TikTok. Is because when someone goes somewhere and types in influencer marketing. I want ’em to find me, right? So that’s exactly why I’m doing it too. You know, while we were talking there, Tinashe I was thinking if branded content series continue to take off and we build on this over the next few years, in about three or four years, influencer content is gonna look a lot like network sitcoms and TV shows one day.

I mean, we’re kind of going back to what we’ve always gone back to, the video entertainment that really engages people. We’re just kind of migrating that creator content toward that model I would think?

[00:34:37] Tinashe: Yeah, a hundred percent. Especially when you look at Snapchat stories and all those different shows coming out of there and, and, and their push for that. There will be that switch where a lot of those, uh, TV advertisers will realize whole crap, I should probably be shifting most of my budget here, and on top of that, I can be a brand myself owning this content as well.

[00:34:55] Jason: I’m also saying that because I’m trying to refire the engines around the thought process to teach people to turn the damn phone sideways. Let’s get back to horizontal video coz vertical, I hate vertical video, but just…

[00:35:08] Tinashe: You hate vertical?

[00:35:09] Jason: That’s me being an old school guy, man, I cut my teeth on literal radio and TV back in the eighties and nineties, and that’s what I learned how to produce on and now you’ve got vertical video, which just drives me nuts cuz TV sets and computers and what-not aren’t vertical. But I have to admit, phones are, or at least the way people typically hold them, no one ever figured out, oh look, I can do this and turn it sideways and then I can see the full video.

[00:35:32] Tinashe: Yeah. It’s especially so like the Gen Z, cause especially for me, like it was really diving into the, TikTok boom, that forced me as a, you know, agency owner to be active on it. And seeing these freshmen in college or you know, middle schoolers when they’re in a conversation and they have, you know, an argument. They’re not sitting there just theorizing, oh okay, so here’s the facts of what I found, or here’s a video, or here’s this, right? They’re so quick and integrated to it that, you know, it’s very interesting to see how vertical plays a part in that.

[00:36:00] Jason: Using the internet for facts. Holy crap, we’re doomed as a society. Tinashe, where can people find you and sosani on the inner-webs?

[00:36:09] Tinashe: Yeah, of course. So if you’re interested as a brand, you can always go to, and of course, let’s connect on LinkedIn. I’m always on there @TinasheChaponda and also our TikTok that we’re going called Influencer Anatomy. Where I essentially talk about different, uh, feedback and advice for brands looking to work with influencers. It’s currently Influencer Anatomy, but we will be rebranding to Creator Anatomy in the next month or so once ah, TikTok will let me change my username.

[00:36:37] Jason: Smart. Yeah. We’re getting rid of the word influencer. Okay, we’ll make sure links to all those are in the show notes. Be sure to check Tinashe and sosani out folks. Give him, some thought and give some thought, your own self to branded content series, I think that’d be a really smart thing for you to do. Your brand too could have one. Tinashe, thanks for the wisdom, sir. Appreciate you being here.

[00:36:57] Tinashe: Yeah, of course, Jason. Anytime.

[00:37:02] Jason: Fun conversation there with Tinashe, go check out the OKAY tinashe videos on YouTube. There’s still pretty fun stuff, especially if you like K-Pop. Not my thing in terms of music, but his reactions to the K-pop stuff, it’s pretty amusing, it’s fun stuff. Speaking of fun stuff, I need your help telling more people about our fun here on Winfluence.

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Winfluence, the Influence Marketing Podcast is an audio companion to my book Winfluence: Reframing Influencer Marketing To ignite Your Brand. Get your copy [email protected]. While you’re there, sign up for the latest ideas about influence marketing delivered in my periodic newsletter, or book me to speak to your company or organization about influence marketing.

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